Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Umm_fish?)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 20:36:42 GMT

I don't know, Jeremy. She looks like she has the extra flaps to me.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 10:42:30 GMT

Mama again. I think she is still swollen, but note that she does not seem to have the extra flaps under the jaw (though again out of focus a bit).

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 10:40:46 GMT

mama from the same pair. Short, but a good look. Quite swollen, bit out of focus.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 10:36:57 GMT

Another from the same pair.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 10:32:26 GMT

Here is a video of a male / female bluespot spawning.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 09:31:33 GMT

How do you do that? Lots of patience with the camera? Or take them out of the water?

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (mPedersen)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 09:16:19 GMT

Do not be afraid to VENT them. Take macro shots of the ventral surface, specifically the anus and genital openings. This is how MANY freshwater fish can be reliably sexed.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 09:02:13 GMT

I'm going to try and see if I can snag a few of them, and get the LFS to let me return the all buy one after I'm done trying to sex them (heck, may be able to sex several them and thus help them sell some, or sell some pairs).

I'm going to try and rig up some fully enclosed net "cage" like a breeders net but with a top on it that I can sink into the tank, but yet be able to pull back out easily. I don't think I'd be able to get a blue spot out of my tank with out tearing it a part.

I'm picking up some used tanks tonight to start working on a basement setup. Not sure how quickly I can get it going though. (I'd like to clean the basement work room and put down some epoxy on the floor first, but that's on a long honey-do list).

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Umm_fish?)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 07:43:23 GMT

The problem is that I don't know if anyone knows. They were/are so expensive and such delicate fish (lots of deaths right out of the fish store) for so long. On top of that, they are so hard to pair. It's only a small subset of the hobby that would try to keep these fish and a much smaller subset that would even try to pair them. There's just not much data to go on. I think this is a great project though, because if we _can_ figure something out, it'll be a great boon later on.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Mon, 30 Aug 2010 07:19:28 GMT

Made it out to the LFS, unfortunately they only had one bluespot in stock, so it was not much help. Looking back at Sissy's video, her male and female look identical (though you can only see the heads). I wonder if adding a bluespot in a enclosed net container or critter container will cause the bluespot that I currently have to react enough to see the color changes?

Is it just the males that are supposed to change colors in defense of their homes?

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Umm_fish?)

Sun, 29 Aug 2010 11:56:50 GMT

It depends on your tank. My fish store does it all the time. I doubt I'd be able to get mine out, though.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Sun, 29 Aug 2010 07:10:58 GMT

I've just been flipping through the downloaded pictures and I'm not sure I can find a clear distinguishing feature. Color seems hard to tell since the lighting and the fact that they can change color makes it unpredictable. I'm not sure I see a difference in head size. Some do seem to have a darker area behind the eyes. I'm trying to see if some have more excess skin under the jaw area, but most of these pictures don't show that.

So, how hard is it to get a blue spot out of a tank if the two are the same sex?

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Sat, 28 Aug 2010 16:32:01 GMT

Here is a video of my bluespot. Sex is unknown, however I'm suspecting a male. Just a very early guess based on the dark coloration and the extra flaps of skin under his jam (supposedly for extra room for babies?)

Hope it works, its my first attempt with youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIPgGObsTvU

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Umm_fish?)

Sat, 28 Aug 2010 14:37:06 GMT

Okay, I went back through a bunch of old photos and found some things for you:

Here are a few shots of Oscar, my known male:

And here is a series of photos of second, probably male, bluespot in an agonistic encounter with Oscar. Oscar is the fish that comes in and steals this fish's home:

As you can see, the fighting, territorial defense colors get very close to the courtship colors.

I hope that helps.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (mPedersen)

Fri, 27 Aug 2010 21:40:01 GMT

Andy, a full body shot, similar in the layout to all those other fish, would be EXTREMELY helpful. That way people could take proportional measurements and start making comparisons and looking at an overall dataset.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Fri, 27 Aug 2010 21:15:48 GMT

Andy,

Does he seem to always have that darker, more golden yellow color and more gray body color? If you look at Matt's pictures (keeping in mind lighting) there are several that are clearly darker and more golden and others that are clearly lighter and more light yellow.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Umm_fish?)

Fri, 27 Aug 2010 15:29:31 GMT

Okay. This is a known male. Remember that his jaw is a little screwed up.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Umm_fish?)

Fri, 27 Aug 2010 15:16:04 GMT

And heck, that guy is still alive. He doesn't leave his hole very often, but I can get some more photos.

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Fishtal)

Fri, 27 Aug 2010 14:41:53 GMT

Here is a nice video but no idea of sex. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tmcr1EtLcjc&NR=1

Re:Opistignathos rosenblattii Sexing Project (Rook)

Fri, 27 Aug 2010 14:37:25 GMT

That should be a helpful video. Only males exhibit the mating colors, right? So we are pretty confident that the jaw in that video is a male.