Breeding Journal, Species: [Amphiprion Ocellaris]

General
Species:  Amphiprion Ocellaris
Social Structure: 

Size of Individuals:  Male: 2 inches, Female: 3 inches
Age of Individuals:  3 yrs old
Date added to Tank:  Feb 2008

Broodstock Tank Details
Size of Tank:  14 gal
Substrate Details:  1 inch sandbed
Filtration Details:  Oceanic Biocube - Stock Filtration
Water Changes:  None - top off as needed
Water Temperature: 78 degrees 
Lighting:  Standard
Lighting Cycle:  7am-9pm
Other Tank Inhabitants:  1 Turbo, 1 Tonga Nassarius, 1 Peppermint Shrimp, Few mini blue legs

Broodstock Feeding Details
Food Types:  Pellet, Fake, Mysis, Sea weed...soon to be Roe
Feeding Schedule:  3-4 times/day

Spawning Details
Date of First Spawn:  1/11/2011
Spawn Time of Day:  8:15pm
Dates of Consecutive Spawns: 
Courtship Details: 
Egg Size: caviar size? 
Egg Color:  1st laid: yellowish/golden
Egg Count:  (?) Many

Hatch Details
Hatch Date:  1/21/2011
Hatch Time of Day: 
# Days after Spawn: 10
Larvae Description: Tiny, silvery/clear bodies,black eyes, orange bellies, tadpole-like tails 


Larval Tank Details
Temperature: 78 degrees 
Size of Larval Tank:  5 gallon
Substrate Details: bare
Other Tank Decor:  heater, air stone, air rod
Filtration Details:  None, will siphon debris out as needed
Lighting:  shop light / ambient light from room
Lighting Cycle:  increased lighting - 6am - 11pm
Water Changes:  Adding brood stock water as top off

Larval Feeding Details
Food Types:  Feeding rotifers, otohime, more as progress occurs
Feeding Schedule:  Feeding 4 x daily

Metamorphosis/Settlement
Date of Settlement Start: 
Days after Hatch: 
Date of Settlement End: 
Description of Fry: 

Grow-Out Tank Details
Temperature:  78 degrees
Size of Grow-Out Tank:  20 gal long
Substrate Details:  will probably do a bare bottom
Other Tank Decor:  some live rock, a heater as above, an anemone(?) sponge filter then change to  hang on backfilter
Filtration Details:  will continue to siphon until babies are big enough for HOB filter
Lighting: 
Lighting Cycle: 
Water Changes: 
Size at Transfer:  ?
Age at Transfer:  ?

Grow-Out Feeding Details
Food Types: 
Feeding Schedule: 

Additional Information
Miscellaneous Information(NO PHOTOS OR VIDEO): 



You will be required to provide photographic or video evidence in this thread of each event submitted for the MBI Program.
If your thread does not contain these photos the MBI Committee will not be able to approve your reports. PHOTOS AND VIDEO S MUST BE PLACED IN ADDITIONAL POSTS, NEVER IN THE FIRST POST IN A JOURNAL.

Michelle  
 

Ok, New Spawn....New Year....New Journal
I hope this is a good one.... have been getting everything ready. Just picked up several tanks at Petco (btw..great sale going on...$1/gallon for tanks) for possible Grow Out or Rotifer / Phyto Tanks.
Here is the very 1st video of the journal.... waited 2 days to be able to record the laying of the eggs - glad I caught it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2QZe2oFT0go 
 
Ok everyone....WISH ME LUCK and please feel welcome to jump onto my link and offer any encouragement or critique that you see needs to be shared.
 
I will try to make an entry each day, to record more of what I missed in the other journals.
The catching of the larvae is down pat... my only concern is my rotifers, which I have been feeding/splitting... so hopefully I will be ok. BUT, as a precaution, I am getting another shipment just in case
 
Have a great evening-
Goodnight!

Michelle  
 

Ooops Apologies to everyone,,, wee little debate over chicken/ the outside grill with my 16yr old, lol... forget how the camera picks up every sound... sorry. Disregard... wating on you tube to attach music to the video...

Michelle  
 

The video is private   Can't wait to see it. 
 
Which tanks are you planning on using to grow rotifers?  Where are you ordering your rotifers from?  Are you using paste or live phyto?

Sorry- youtube is not cooperating with the music swap. Deleted and reposted the video... should be good to see now (hopefully, lol)
 
I am not 100% sure yet of the rotifer tank...as I read somewhere that glass is not the best...and to stick with plastic buckets/tubs? Any preference on your part? Right now I am using buckets... but I thought I might have a better growth rate if I switched to a bigger container (hence the aquarium)
 
Petco was (and is til Saturday 15th) having a $1/per gallon tank sale. So I snatched up a 55 gal (possibly for my coral frags) and 4 20L's. (they were out of the Breeder 40g size) I have 1 20L set up as a macro tank, that I am slowly adding different types of algae to - to try and grow.
 
I am planning on using another 20L as the sump/make shift refugium for the acrylic holding tank I am getting from one of our LFS owners, who is parting with it for me
 
I thought of using another 20L for a grow out tank.... does anyone prefer height over width? Does it make a difference as far as the baby clowns are concerned, their growth rate/swimming etc? Will they be good in a 20L- or should I continue to look for the 40g breeder style? (waiting to see if Petco's truck can make it to the south! They got snowed in from what I heard yesterday)
 
The actual use of the tanks are still under thought, as I have alot I want to do, and trying to find room to do it all in. lol I may have to move my dining room table into the fish room, and make the dining room a fish room #2
 
I do not have any stands right now, so planning on what to use.... was thinking grabbing several mason blocks from Lowe's, and a strong wood base and build temp tables... would like to have this set up before hubby gets home, lol so he doesn't have to do anything.... but I have not plumbed my main tank- he has... so I may have to wait on setting up my acrylic display. (also thought of using that as a grow-out? Has several chambers)
 
Rotifers: I ordered from ebay (very good source- very dense and quick shipping, but not off the top of my head, will get back to you) He is here in Florida, not that far from me, and he raises fish in his aqua-nursery. Sells the rotifers among other items. Will post his name when I jump back onto ebay.
 
Phyto: I also bought from ebay, from California, to try this one out. It is a blend of like 6 different types - only thing is it needs to be refrigerated until you are using it, so I have it set up in a mini fridge next to the larvae station. The previous phyto I was using (til it crashed) was a starter from a fellow reefer... and I just maintained that- adding my solution, light, splitting when needed.. but this type now must remain refrigerated. I may try the pastes... but I do like the live- so not sure which has the better results.
 
***************
1/12/2011
Came home this evening, will post another pic- eggs are still a goden yellow/orange color, hard to see in the terra cotta pot.... Pappa Clown is doing his duty- maintaining the eggs... while Mamma Clown is feeding and getting her color back. Odd how she lightened up during the week of her spawning. (hard to see on the video, more noticeable in person)
 
Ok- guys... gotta go... please feel free to check out the video- hoping it is readily available for you now- music and all

Michelle  
 

{word to the wise... it is a LONG video, as I wanted to try and film the entire process...sooooo you may wish to fast forward}

Michelle  
 

Ok- sorry- here is the rotifer link I used:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ROTIFERS-COPEPODS-LIVE-FISH-FOOD-Coral-Larvae-Fry-K-/160529024253?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25604684fd 
 
 

Michelle  
 

(Question... when counting days- they laid on the 11th..in the evening.... so the 12th would be Day 2?
Or count the 12th as Day 1 'post spawn'?) 
 
 I think I may be wrong in counting the 12th as Day 2.....
 
Any opinions?
 

Michelle  
 

If I understand correctly, the 12th would be the first day post spawn. 

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Thanks Tal - Ok.... changing my numbers......lol!

Michelle  
 

Day 1 Post Spawn:

 

Eggs are not quite as visible, as they are golden yellow/light orange.

 

 

Michelle  
 

Day 2 Post Spawn:
 
Eggs are more clearly seen from up close, do not show well on video yet, color is darkening up slightly.
 
 
 

Michelle  
 

CMPenney & Fishtal :
Thanks for correcting / editing my videos... what is it I am not doing correctly?
If I remember... once I put the link in, am I to 'space' at the end? Am I creating a broken link and that's why it doesn't show up as video right away?
 
Please let me know so I can correct it, but I thank you both for catching / fixing it for me

Michelle  
 

I've tried two different containers.  First, I just sat the 1G bag of rotifers in an 8 quart square Rubbermaid container and dropped in a air line.  I like this arrangement because I could actually see the rotifers.  Currently, I'm using a orange 5G bucket which makes judging the water color tough at best.  I read the same thing you did about not using aquariums for rotifers so I'm a bit at a loss.  I'm considering using a clear 22 quart rubbermaid container but was hoping you had a better idea

 

Thanks for the link to the rotifer seller.  FWIW, I used Mariculutre Technologies Inc (http://www.livebrineshrimp.com/) for both phyto and rotifers.  Since they are in FL we get very reasonable shipping rates even for overnight deliveries.

 

Good luck and thanks for sharing the videos!

I use white 5G buckets and they work great. Much easier to clean than a rectangular tank, they take up less space and since the rotifers don't need light I just keep the lids on, not tight, and that helps with evaporation issues.

 

I'll send you a PM about the vids.

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Ok ok ok ... lol... have to come back to read the above, BUT wanted to share :
Went to LFS at lunch for the tank I am picking up... and they got the baby picassos in that I want ! (I had previously asked him how much they would be and how hard they would be to find if he ordered them... he got 4 babies in - is charging $75 each! Ugh! I want them May go back!!!) Also baby blacks and cinnamons Sooooo adorable
 
The 2 I really want are gorgeous! There is also a misbar that looks more like those Wisconsin Whites (?) as the sides are mainly white.... but they are all so cute!
 
Ok- back to work - just wanted to share!

Michelle  
 

Real quick- as I don't know where else to post this:
 
Congrats to Matt Pedersen, Donie Marie Posey, Tal Sweet, Andrew Berry, and Chelsey Kennedy!!!
 
(just saw you in the MBI article of the Reef Hobbyist Magazine )
 
Very Cool Guys
 

Michelle  
 

$75 for Picassos is a good price. One thing to keep in mind though. If they are small and there isn't black around the white areas yet, the white will most likely continue to spread. So the patterns may change, for the better, IMO.

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Thanks for the info- I did run back and place a hold on the 2 that I wanted... so cute!
 
And they have a LONG ways to go before they start to breed, but they are small enough that they should pair up with no problem (?) So hopefully I know what to do by then, haha!
 
The rotifers: yeah... I think I will stick with the buckets - seems to work for alot of people, and I agree on the cleaning the corners of the tank- that would probably be aggravating as time goes on... collecting debris.
 
I will def check out the www.livebrineshrimp.com thanks for the link I know I have visited them before... just honestly forgot about them So thanks!

Michelle  
 

January 14, 2011 .....Day 3 PS
 
Eggs have darkened in color... can see them nicely as I walked into the room.
Round in shape- not oblong yet.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wht4WZgrGzY&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

Michelle  
 

January 15, 2011 - Today is Day 4 PS
Eggs are swaying nicely...taking on an oblong appearance
Pappa Clown is tending to the eggs while Mamma Clown is eating- getting her strength back
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nopQ31kzMN0&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
 
(on a side note- got the baby picasso tank set up earlier this evening... and setting up the larvae tank tomorrow... thinking I will have it set up a few days before the eggs are due to hatch, so that I can have some rotifers feeding/multiplying in the tank before I place the larvae in.
Sound about right?) I have been waiting until the actual day - so I think I will start tomorrow.
 
So far the pair is great, temp is 78' as normal - they are eating well - hoping this time I can see this through

Michelle  
 

I set up the larval tanks right before I move the tiles and use water from the broodstock system. That way they are in the exact same water that they have been in. I wait until the next morning to add rots and phyto. Clowns don't need to eat as soon as they hatch, unlike dottybacks. 

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Tal- that's what I had been doing... but I thought perhaps some of my failed attempts may have been a result of not setting the tank up early enough.
 
I have been turning off the lights... and as I waited for the larvae to hatch, I was slowly taking water from the broodstock tank and putting it into the larval tank- then, after every  last larvae swam to the top- and I had them situated... I went back and added fresh water to the broodstock system and turned it back on again. I liked this method thinking it was the exact parameters- but again, lol, after failed attempts you start second guessing your motions.
 
I am not using the probiotics ever again, and think that the last hatch may have done well...as my rotifers then were very dense. I could see the babies darting to and from eating... so if I am able to maintain my rotifers (have been reading up on this as well for more homework ) I am hoping to recreate a healthy batch of larvae
 
I am feeding phyto -not too much- but enough to keep an olive green color - have decided to stick with the white bucket for now as it is easier to see the phyto color changing, and the density of the rotifers. I may change this and try a controlled 5 or 10 gal tank- when I have enough backup rots...just as an experiment. But until I have a handle on when to tell how much I actually have on hand... I don't want to play with the ones I have,lol.
 
The ONLY thing that I may change right now- is my thermostat. I have been using the small 78 degrees, (can't remember the name right now- but it is a consistent 78 degrees- never changes, no worry of overheating,or burning out.) That's what I use for my smaller tanks/biocube. I think I may change that for the larval tank- (and the baby picasso tank I set up) as I know you guys have mentioned higher temp=faster meta change. Is it correct in thinking I am slowing down their progress by keeping them at a lower temp?
 
Also- side note on the otohime to Tal (or anyone else using it): I am still not 100% sure how to use it. The website doesn't really give instructions on the stages (or maybe I didn't see it, please point it out)... do I just 'guestimate' as to which package to use as they grow...depending on the size of the fish? The EP1 & 2 look more like pond feed to me..... at what stage do you use those?
 
Thanks to those reading/commenting..... Today is Day5 PS....YEAH! So anxious, lol!

Michelle  
 

On the other hand, my clowns were taken as eggs from a friend's tank, moved halfway across town with little to no aeration (air pump died on the way home), plopped into a tub of completely different water (that had already been cycled though) and did pretty darn well. My display tank has hydroids so there's no way I want that water in a larval tank. Cycling it seems to be the really important bit, however you do it. Whether that be by taking old water from the folks' tank or having a fleet of sponge filters going in a central (cycled) reservoir so that you can add one to the larval tank a few days before hatch is your choice.
 
You are correct on the EP1 and 2. It _is_ pond feed. I haven't used Oto with larvae yet (I have used it as coral food). Instead, I made my own: Mortar and pestle and a good quality pellet food.

--Andy, the bucket man.
"Not to know the mandolin is to argue oneself unknown...." --Clara Lanza, 1886

I had the same question wrt to Otohime.  After a while of vacuuming it off of the bottom of the tank I got a feel for which they are eating.  I would use A until post meta and then add B1 as you slowly stop offering A.  About 5 days post meta I slowly switched from B1 to B2.  I'm ~two weeks past that and still offering B2 but most fish are taking C1 now.

Ok- well, as stated above, lol today is.....DAY 5 Post Spawn
Looking at 1/19/2011 as possible hatch night
 
I am going to play abit on here this afternoon- as I think maybe I have a setting off in some way?
I tried the suggestion re: my videos- didn't seem to work right....
And when I click the Start Public Chat on the bottom right (thanks Tal for pointing that out ) nothing happens. At all. And my pm's are not able to be replied to directly...so, maybe somewhere in my profile I haven't set up a setting...or have to update something? Not sure... but will play around with it, have not been in my profile to change it since I originally signed up- so again, not sure if there is something I didn't select ...... just throwing this out there in case you guys are wondering why my links are still in my posts
 

Michelle  
 

Who has heard of and uses Masago?

 

Got the tip from a fellow fishlover on facebook... picked up the roe on friday, but in all the hustle bustle of running to the asian store with a friend, running out and rushing to the LFS..... didn't notice that they were 'seasoned'.

 

I asked for plain, unseasoned when I called... but this is what they held for me when I ran in.

 

If I rinse well, what adverse affects would you think it would cause:

ingredients are: capelin roe, sugar, salt, soy sauce (water,soy beans,wheat,salt),sorbitol,msg,FD&C Yellow no 6.

 

Found a couple of OLD links on reefcentral referring to it, and they rinsed it off... but they were old posts. Any ideas as to offering these to my clowns/reef tank ? I cannot find any unseasoned online that is not in mass amount.... anyone buy them?? And from where??

Michelle  
 

I use Masago sometimes but I soak it pretty well first. I run water over it through a little sieve. The fish don't seem to mind.

--Andy, the bucket man.
"Not to know the mandolin is to argue oneself unknown...." --Clara Lanza, 1886

Thanks- I was a bit cautious of the seasoned variety...but really, it is quite hard to locate the unseasoned. But I am going back to the asian store this afternoon to see if they are able to order it, in the meantime, I will def rinse well.
 
Ok- next question... lol... how to get a few copepods out of your rotifer culture without losing your rotifers?(noticed some are in one of my containers... any suggestions?)

Michelle  
 

Why do you want copepods out of your rot cultures? Copepods (harpacticoids) are a pretty good cleanup crew.

--Andy, the bucket man.
"Not to know the mandolin is to argue oneself unknown...." --Clara Lanza, 1886

As  far as the copepods go.... won't they compete for food against the rotifers?
 
Ran to the LFS to check on my new little babies at lunch... Awww..! So cute!
They were being held in 4 separate chambers, as he was afraid of them fighting before he could sell them all.
The 2 that I am getting are together - apparently he came in this morning and went to look at them, the smaller of the 2 of mine had slipped thru the slots, and they are now paired up swimming side by side  xoxoxo So happy !
 
Just felt like sharing... ok- more on the rotifers..... so, how do I then keep the copepods at bay, so as not to overcrowd my rotifers? So the rotifers are still able to feed/breed? Or am I not understanding ?
 
Thanks
 
 

Michelle  
 

The rots eat the food in the water column. The copepods eat the leftovers (rotifer poop, especially).

--Andy, the bucket man.
"Not to know the mandolin is to argue oneself unknown...." --Clara Lanza, 1886

Copepods reproduce at a much slower rate than rotifers too.

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Ok- thanks guys- appreciate the info.
 
On a side note aside from this journal (but will need to know when babies are in play anyway)
Whay type of filter do you use for babies? I am picking up the picassos tomorrow... and have set up a triangle foam bubbler type.. but what type of actual filtration system can you use? I am trying to consider that I do not want any strong current, or suction.. as they are so small... what is suggested?
 

Michelle  
 

My juveniles stay in a stand alone 10G for about 4 weeks. I add a sponge filter during week 2. I move them to the grow out system when they are too big to fit through the screen I have around the drain pipe. This group has been in there for a while but you get the idea.

 

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Tal- right now I have the sponge filter (triangle foam sponge filter) set up in a 20L....not quite filled to the top with water- I assumed that this would be good enough for now...and when they were old/strong enough I could add a filter. What is best in this type of tank setup? I am thinking I may end up getting another biocube, as I love the all-in-one for the mated pair I have. But still, curious if there are better filters for in tank or hob. I am not seeing any for saltwater at Petsmart or Petco... or the LFS this evening.
 
Update on my eggs..... they are thinning out.
So what exactly makes the male/female thin out the mass? Are the ones taken away not viable? Are they dead? And if so, wouldn't they have fallen from the pot, rather than continue to stick to it? Or is there another reason as to why the numbers go down as the day draws near?
 
(hmmm... has anyone heard of : lower hatch / rearing success rates if the mated pair is cross bred? Still thinking of that comment made to me....is there anything to that?)

Michelle  
 

How big are they?

 

The pair will thin them out if they are bad, or sometimes if the pair gets stressed. My dottys do that if I try to clean their tank when eggs are present.

 

I haven't heard of that but some species of clowns are harder to raise than others.

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

The picassos are maybe an inch?
************
Hmm...well that is my fault then, as I did clean their front glass the other day. Usually I leave it alone - so maybe I stressed them out?
************
 
Yeah...that was a comment Bob Fenner made in email to me, when he suggested my pair was a Percularis...ocellaris + percula... so curious... as alot of you seem to breed different pairs of clowns together.

Michelle  
 

The Picassos will be fine at that size. Nothing special needs to be done other than normal precautions.
 
Might have stressed them out, never know.
 
I'd agree with Bob. 

http://www.fishtalpropagations.com/#!home/mainPage
"Making captive breeding easier."

Thank you on the size reference . Makes me feel a bit better of them in the tank
******
Will leave the broodstock tank alone when eggs are present from now on to see if that changes.
******
Yeah..... kinda hoping you weren't gonna say that So,in your opinion, does that mean that I should expect a low hatch on every clutch of eggs perhaps? Maybe that's why they are thinned as they are over the days since the male knows they are not good.....or do you know if as they continue to spawn that this is something that will correct itself?

Michelle