Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.

Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.

yes
  50% (5)
no
  20% (2)
not sure
  30% (3)

Total Votes: 10

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Fishtal
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, February 1, 2014 1:59 AM
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Personally, I'm more interested in producing high quality livestock for my local market that trying to compete on a national scale. That's just me. I'm not doing this to get rich, rather to do business on a high quality level. Not that I'm against what the big players are doing... I just prefer to do my own thing, locally.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, February 1, 2014 11:06 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by dave w
 But a co-op would make it feasible for members to raise special fish that would otherwise overwhelm their local market.  Maroon clowns for example.  If you raised a batch of 200 babies you'd have to warehouse them for years before your local market could absorb so many.  If done right, a co-op could kill two birds with one stone.  It could use MBI people to raise special fish which can only be absorbed by a national market, and the larger variety would create a complete product line that retail stores want.  No retailer wants to deal with ten different fish sellers, that's why only two national producers offer a full line and dominate the national market.   But if a co-op of specialized breeders offered 15 or 20 popular fish and a number of popular inverts, retailers would come through with orders.   Especially if one of the two big boys knocked the other out of business at some point and prices increased.
 
Agreed!
Obviously we're getting WAAY ahead of ourselves on this, but one can't begin to plan a venture without thinking ahead.  I haven't been around the wholesale end of the fish business, but my observations as an outsider for 30 years is that whenever a single company dominates the market prices are high, and it has yet to be proven over a multi year period that the national market is big enough for two big players.  There is a good chance that one big player emerges to serve the national market and prices will rise again.

Quote Originally Posted by dave w
 But back up. I don't think it will be successful without a full line of different species of fish, all captively bred and reared.  With only 50% of the people answering this poll saying that they think its a good idea, I am not sure there are enough breeders willing to risk a little money and a lot of faith to see if this thing will work.  We need a critical mass to make marketting be effective.  If enough people with enough species joined up, we could find out if it would appeal to the stores that buy our goods, and once the ball got rolling it would not only be successful at drawing in new breeders, but drawing in more buyers, and more advertising. What I really hope it will do is encourage more people to try their hand at breeding saltwater fish! If we make it easier to unload the products, it becomes more fun and profitable to create the products.


I agree 100% and see that we think alike.  With a full product line (and a dry goods wholesaler running the holding facility?) every other decision is easy.  If a co-op can't bring together a critical mass of species then it will never get off the ground.  As far as encouraging new breeders, that could be arranged.  Even if a co-op offerred 15 fish the majority would still be ocellaris.  New breeders could be given a slot for ___ number of weekly ocellaris if they also attempted to widen the product line with another species. Or anyone who added to the species list could get a larger percentage of total ocellaris sales with each additional species.
 

dave w
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, February 1, 2014 11:21 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by Fishtal


Personally, I'm more interested in producing high quality livestock for my local market that trying to compete on a national scale. That's just me. I'm not doing this to get rich, rather to do business on a high quality level. Not that I'm against what the big players are doing... I just prefer to do my own thing, locally.

 
Tal, I agree with you.  Your example illustrates what I think is the market reality.  There is an old British expression about "falling between two stools".  I think there are only two business models that work here.  First is high quality fish delivered to local stores with strong personal connections and no shipping costs.  You are a perfect example of this.   Second is a product line large enough to compete in the national market, and even this may not work in the competitive environment of two big suppliers.  In my opinion anything between local and national cannot succeed.   But I don't pretend to be an expert in the fish business and I could be wrong.
 
I think a dry goods partner/sponsor would answer the issues regarding shipping losses and costs and the expense of running the holding facility.....  I think a wholesaler would take on this business at a very low profit margin because it would increase their dry goods sales.  Just my opinion.
KathyL
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, February 1, 2014 11:59 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by dave w


...With a full product line (and a dry goods wholesaler running the holding facility?) every other decision is easy.  
 


But you see, I think we should avoid the central holding facility. Which wholesaler of dry goods would want to invest in the infrastructure and personnel to run such a facility? The advantage of dry goods is that you can store them in an unheated warehouse. Not so with fish.  In addition, the wholesaler would need to be paid. Where does this money come from?  The fewer entities taking a cut of the revenue the better.  I would like to funnel more money to the magic makers, the breeders themselves.  Otherwise, there is little incentive to do the work of researching and raising that which has not been done before, except for bragging rights.
 
On the other hand, if the dry goods wholesaler wants to advertise on our site, that would be GREAT! That would generate revenue that could be put to overhead and shipping costs.  The more wholesalers, the better.  For the wholesalers, they get to market DIRECTLY to LFS using our site.  Its more like a laser gun than a shotgun approach.
 
 Or if they want to have a "store" on our site, that would also be cool, in my opinion.
 
Quote Originally Posted by dave w
If a co-op can't bring together a critical mass of species then it will never get off the ground.  As far as encouraging new breeders, that could be arranged.
 
Agreed, but the encouragement will come automatically if this thing gets off the ground.  You see, it solves problems for the breeder as well as the buyer. The buyer would have a central place from which to order captive bred fish, and the breeder would have a way to unload his products, make a profit, and not have to bother with marketing, which is huge.  That would make it more reasonable for the breeder to invest in infrastructure and research to get the discovery ball rolling. The more brains we have working on the discovery part, the more quickly we can figure out how to get marine species captively bred. It may take money, getting paid, to motivate the brains we need.  A better selling vehicle, with marketing built in, could work.
 
 
Quote Originally Posted by dave w
 Even if a co-op offerred 15 fish the majority would still be ocellaris.  New breeders could be given a slot for ___ number of weekly ocellaris if they also attempted to widen the product line with another species. Or anyone who added to the species list could get a larger percentage of total ocellaris sales with each additional species. 

The reality, based on my experience, is that the largest number of single species fish purchased/month by LFS is orange ocellaris.  There is no problem if the breeder has ocellaris to offer on the marketplace or not.  I would not like to restrict what can be placed on the marketplace.  Whatever the breeder has to offer should be allowed and encouraged.  The market will determine what gets sold and how fast. Indivdual breeders can price their fish how they wish, and then buyers can get the fish they want at the price they want.  If breeder A wants to sell his ocellaris at $1 each, he can, but breeder B may have a higher quality ocellaris due to color, shape, size, any number of variables, and will ask for $10 each.  There may be a market for both, but we'll never know if we don't give it a go. I see no problem with the same species being offered at different prices by different breeders, or even the same breeder.  I am selling fish right now at two different sizes, with two different prices.  It's fine.  Let's keep it simple, and let the market determine the winners.
 
In addition, hypothetically, say I get tired of ocellaris, or no longer feel it is profitable for me.  I want to spend my resources growing filefish and dartfish.  With our new marketplace, I can do that, and still sell what I produce.  Without the marketplace, I will fail to sell anything, if I don't have ocellaris to offer as well. It is the reality, and it is a real discouragement to the discovery effort.  Ocellaris can suck up all the time one has to raise fish, and prevent any effort on other species. But without ocellaris, it is diffcult to sell anything.  Ask Edgar Diaz.
 
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
(Wholesale to the trade.)
KathyL
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, February 1, 2014 12:16 PM
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Quote Originally Posted by Fishtal


Personally, I'm more interested in producing high quality livestock for my local market that trying to compete on a national scale. That's just me. I'm not doing this to get rich, rather to do business on a high quality level. Not that I'm against what the big players are doing... I just prefer to do my own thing, locally.

 
And I think this is wonderful, and you should continue to do this for as long as you can.  I did it for many years, until one of the big boys undercut my price so severely, and had a variety of other products to offer, that I will never be able to offer, that it made no sense for the LFS to buy from me. Its business, its the market, and its the way it is. I can't complain.  I am also not against what the big boys are doing, even though it has hurt my business severely.  In order to adjust to the new market, I have to compete with this big boy, and I simply can't.
 
If we could get enough support from people breeding ocellaris, as well as other fishes in addition to, or  other than ocellaris, we could, as a coop, have a chance to compete on the national marketplace, and I think it would be good for everyone.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
(Wholesale to the trade.)
dave w
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 12:24 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by KathyL
I would like to funnel more money to the magic makers, the breeders themselves.  Otherwise, there is little incentive to do the work of researching and raising that which has not been done before, except for bragging rights.

 
I'm sure you'd agree that the marketer would also be a magic maker, as would the entrepreneur who could set up all the parts of a deal to make your co-op idea work.   I actually think a wholesaler would be a natural fit, although I don't know the fish business.
 
Quote Originally Posted by KathyL
 The reality, based on my experience, is that the largest number of single species fish purchased/month by LFS is orange ocellaris.  There is no problem if the breeder has ocellaris to offer on the marketplace or not.  I would not like to restrict what can be placed on the marketplace.  Whatever the breeder has to offer should be allowed and encouraged.  The market will determine what gets sold and how fast. Indivdual breeders can price their fish how they wish, and then buyers can get the fish they want at the price they want.  If breeder A wants to sell his ocellaris at $1 each, he can, but breeder B may have a higher quality ocellaris due to color, shape, size, any number of variables, and will ask for $10 each.  There may be a market for both, but we'll never know if we don't give it a go. I see no problem with the same species being offered at different prices by different breeders, or even the same breeder.  I am selling fish right now at two different sizes, with two different prices.  It's fine.  Let's keep it simple, and let the market determine the winners.

 
I was just suggesting that offering more of the profitable fish was an incentive to get breeders to expand the number of fish available.  But anything that could get the specie count high enough to offer a full line would be acceptable.  Whatever works.
 
I see your idea that the breeders could direct ship to the pet stores without paying twice for shipping, but how do you solve the problem of the fish store having to get a different shipment for each type of fish?  A store wants to open one box with 5 different fish, not 5 different boxes.  I would guess that higher shipping costs is a lesser evil than not giving fish stores the convenience that they want.
 
 
KathyL
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 10:20 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by dave w


Quote Originally Posted by KathyL
I would like to funnel more money to the magic makers, the breeders themselves.  Otherwise, there is little incentive to do the work of researching and raising that which has not been done before, except for bragging rights.


I'm sure you'd agree that the marketer would also be a magic maker, as would the entrepreneur who could set up all the parts of a deal to make your co-op idea work.   I actually think a wholesaler would be a natural fit, although I don't know the fish business.


 
Oh, there is plenty of magic to go around. I appreciate the skills of everyone involved.  It's just that in order to breed and raise a fish that has not previously been "done" it takes a higher level of creativity, research, and skill.  Not everyone can do it.  In fact, for each new species, NO ONE has done it before! It is not simply repeating something one has learned. There is an extra spark required. It's a rare commodity. That is the magic I refer to.  It goes completely unappreciated if the revenue to the breeder is decreased by every entity that handles the fish until there is nothing left for the person who MADE THE FISH HAPPEN, and without whom no one would get paid.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
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dave w
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 10:31 AM
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I understand what you are saying.  It is sad but true that pioneers seldom get rewarded or appreciated for their work.  The people who seem to make the most money seem to be the followers who have access to funding.
 
jazzybio13
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 10:36 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by KathyL

... and without whom no one would get paid.

 
AMEN TO THAT ONE!  
KathyL
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 10:36 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by dave w

I see your idea that the breeders could direct ship to the pet stores without paying twice for shipping, but how do you solve the problem of the fish store having to get a different shipment for each type of fish?  A store wants to open one box with 5 different fish, not 5 different boxes.  I would guess that higher shipping costs is a lesser evil than not giving fish stores the convenience that they want.


I don't solve that problem. 
We are giving the fish store the convenience of one stop shopping, one payment to send, one invoice to keep track of, one website experience. I guess I'm hoping they will just accept the inconvenience of having to open multiple boxes.  Is it a deal breaker? I don't know. 
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
(Wholesale to the trade.)
KathyL
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 10:43 AM
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At this moment, the biggest concern I have, about this idea, is that there are only 5 MBI members who've answered the poll who think its something they would be interested in.  What we need to get this off the ground is 6 - 10 breeders who have something besides ocellaris, or in addition to ocellaris, to offer, and who will commit  to paying a share to the website developer.  Anybody besides me, ready, willing, and able?
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
(Wholesale to the trade.)
jazzybio13
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 10:54 AM
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I would be interested in this, and willing, but not able yet. With a little one there is absolutely NO predictability in my clutches, whether they make the cut or not (even being hatched out! lol), and whether I can keep them alive to sellable age! lol. I'd hope that those who were on board with this could reliably deliver a product, and I don't think I'm there yet. This would be the sole reason for me not participating. 
 
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 4:45 PM
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I'd join, and when I get my system churning out fish, I'd have a place to market them. Kind of betting on the future.
I'm moving in a month, just purchased a house that will afford me a 800SF space on the 3rd floor to dedicate to my fishes! It will be a while before I can produce at a scale to sell, but like I said, I'd commit for the right to sell in the future.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Sunday, February 2, 2014 9:32 PM
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After 3 years under construction, my system is nearly ready to water test but it will still be many moons before I produce something.  I'd like to support the co-op endeavor but my interest is in pelagic fish.  They are so hard to raise and marketing is so distant for me that I don't think about it much.  However I find the idea intriguing and would be happy to support it any way I could.  
<message edited by dave w on Monday, February 3, 2014 6:29 PM>
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Monday, February 3, 2014 4:18 AM
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I guess that's where i'm at.... the idea is super awesome, and the day I CAN produce to demand, I'd be the first one to sign up. 
 
I'm guessing there are several others here this way as well. 
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 2:49 PM
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Sorry to knock the dust off this one, but...
 
My questions come from a different direction, away from shipping and centralization.
What about the "tax guy"?
Florida just got into requiring sales tax for online purchases shipped from Florida.
eBay is supposed to have a limit where you are no longer a 'private seller' and you then have to become a business.
 
At what point (how much $$) does a breeder-hobbyist become a commercial entity?
The money has to be explained. What comes in and what goes out.
 
Other thoughts go toward different types of variety.
Of course any fish that can be bred on a 'regular' basis would find a spot on the website/availability list.
Would there be room for inverts? Food cultures?
Does the interest lay only in the high-end breeds? There's not a lot of wiggle-room on a fish sold to a LFS for $10
 
I'm new here. I have tanks but none have water in them at the moment. But I do hope to try breeding one or two different fish. But I'm going to put some time into inverts also.
 
In the days I've been a member I've read through many of the journals.
I see some great advances, but little variety...in number of species.
Are there a lot more species of fish being successfully bred then I've seen here? And yeah, I've open the forums to "from the beginning".
Is there more to see that my "newness" doesn't allow yet?
 
Anyway, sorry for disturbing the dust-bunnies. Just read this topic and those are a few of the things that popped into my head.
 
Chuck
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 4:11 PM
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Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl


Sorry to knock the dust off this one, but...
 
Knock away!
Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl
 My questions come from a different direction, away from shipping and centralization.
What about the "tax guy"?
Florida just got into requiring sales tax for online purchases shipped from Florida.
 
taxes can be figured out with the software.  Not really a problem.
Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl

eBay is supposed to have a limit where you are no longer a 'private seller' and you then have to become a business.

At what point (how much $$) does a breeder-hobbyist become a commercial entity?
The money has to be explained. What comes in and what goes out.
 
Exactly.  We have 2 choices. 1. Hobbyist: We can breed and sell fish and keep it a hobby, and just add the proceeds of our sales to our regular income from whatever other job one pursues, for income tax purposes. Expenses are just stuff you buy for your hobby, and the IRS doesn't care.
2. Business: You jump through the hoops to get your business recognized by the State, pay fees, etc. and then keep track of all money and trades in and out of the business. Money you spend  to breed fish are reported to the IRS as business expenses, the cost of which is subracted from your income for tax purposes, and money you get from selling fish is added to your income for tax purposes.  The business must make money by the first 3 years (in Missouri) or the business goes back to being a hobby, and you owe taxes on the expenses previously claimed and subtracted from your income.  This didn't happen to me, so I'm not sure how that works, as I was paper profitable at 1.5 years.  Your results may vary. Several years ago the market changed, and I no longer make money.)
Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl


Other thoughts go toward different types of variety.
Of course any fish that can be bred on a 'regular' basis would find a spot on the website/availability list.
Would there be room for inverts? Food cultures?
 
Yes.
Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl

Does the interest lay only in the high-end breeds? There's not a lot of wiggle-room on a fish sold to a LFS for $10
 
I would not restrict to high or low end breeds.
Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl


I'm new here. I have tanks but none have water in them at the moment. But I do hope to try breeding one or two different fish. But I'm going to put some time into inverts also.

In the days I've been a member I've read through many of the journals.
I see some great advances, but little variety...in number of species.
Are there a lot more species of fish being successfully bred then I've seen here? And yeah, I've open the forums to "from the beginning".
Is there more to see that my "newness" doesn't allow yet?
 
I think you've got the jist of it. Not many marine organisms being bred because no one has done them yet.  It's a blooming endeavor. We are getting more on the list all the time, but it not nearly as easy as fresh water fish breeding.
Quote Originally Posted by cjm3fl


Anyway, sorry for disturbing the dust-bunnies. Just read this topic and those are a few of the things that popped into my head.

Chuck

Welcome to MBIsite! Now get some water in those tanks!
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
(Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 4:55 PM
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LOL on the empty tanks. Soon. I promise. I'm beginning a medical disability issue that will free up a whole lot of time.
And thanks for the quick reply, Kathy--and the welcome.
 
Any endeavor I undertake will strictly be as a hobbyist. Maybe the laws have changed but used to be at some point, income wise, a hobbyist bringing in nice profits needed to register as a business. If that's no longer true, fine by me!
But I'm getting off track. As long as I can stay a hobbyist I'm good there.
 
I like what information I've gleaned from here already. There's still a lot I have to re-read and understand better.
 
I understand the change in the market. So many of the best and decades old LFS have closed locally since the 2008 issues. I see the reduced interest on the aquarium (and other) sites I visit. The expendable income just isn't available right now.
 
I'll keep looking and poking around. If I can't find the answer that way I'll drop a post or two. As I mentioned I'll have lots of time available shortly and I would like to expand my experience with marine fish...and it I can drop a few $$ in my pocket from time to time, so much the better.
 
I understand (completely) that this isn't guppy-breeding. But there's stuff to learn and knowledge I might be able to share someday.
 
Chuck
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 5:18 PM
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The last I checked (and that was a long time ago), the threshold for the IRS was making money 3 years out of 5 was what changed you from a hobbyist to a business. I have no idea if that's still true, though.
--Andy, the bucket man.
"Not to know the mandolin is to argue oneself unknown...." --Clara Lanza, 1886
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 5:29 PM
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Thanks. Those are numbers I kinda remember too, Andy
Of course who's to say what is profit and what ain't.
 
If I'm lucky I might get a few fish to adulthood the first couple times. The sale of any of these would be local and just to recover some of the expenses.
 
I don't vision myself being able to put 100 or 200 fish a month on the market. My body won't handle the work needed.
I'd be satisfied with getting a few to market, every now and then.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 5:48 PM
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Quote Originally Posted by
Of course who's to say what is profit and what ain't.

 
My friend who is an IRA auditor seems to have a pretty good handle on it. Money left over after expenses = profit = not a whole lot of chance you'll get there selling fish.
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cjm3fl
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 6:07 PM
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My sister-in-law works for them too. That's the same answer I'd probably get from her.
 
My happiness would lay in just being able to "do it".
Recovering any of my expenses would just be a plus.
 
Chuck
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Saturday, May 9, 2015 11:30 PM
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the advantage of a business, of course, is that you get to be taxed only on the profit: revenues minus expenses. A hobby is taxed solely on the revenues, so the tax amount is higher.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Monday, May 11, 2015 10:48 AM
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A very interesting thread, could it be set up here, with a designated section for the co-op?  And buyers deal directly with the sellers? This site exists, its known, a fee could be agreed on to sell. A lot of possible variations. And the seller controls their prices. Post pics of the parents if fish to sell are small.
 
Whatever, I think the co-op is a valid idea.
Jake
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Monday, May 11, 2015 11:09 PM
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Jake, the Marketplace was an attempt at just that. 
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
http://kathysclowns.com
Captive bred clownfish and more
(Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Tuesday, May 12, 2015 6:15 AM
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and its not enough why?
 
if a co-op can work great, its going to have more expenses then individual sales, which have to be met .
Theres an answer somewhere, several of the larger fish farms in Fla started that way, and most of the largest still buy from smaller farms. 
Jake
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Tuesday, May 12, 2015 8:33 AM
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This site is not well known to buyers who don't use this site. I think the marketting aspect is what is missing. It's very loosely organized, and as it isn't a business outright, it cannot negotiate shipping costs with FEDEX, etc. It's a nice thing for breeders to sell to breeders, but brick and mortar stores don't spend any time browsing this forum.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
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(Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Tuesday, May 12, 2015 8:34 AM
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tell us more about the fish farms in Florida and how they work?
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website:
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Tuesday, May 12, 2015 9:06 AM
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Quote Originally Posted by KathyL

  I think the marketting aspect is what is missing.

This is a very important point.
Marketing is a key reason why many new businesses fail. Or rather improper marketing.
 
The only stuff I know about Florida fish farms is 3rd and 4th hand info.
I've heard that, with a few, not all the fish they offer are breed on-site.
 
Chuck
 
 
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship. - Tuesday, May 12, 2015 10:34 AM
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Few of the big sellers raise all of their own. Half a dozen tranship from the far east and the Mideast, there is a Fla Fish Farmers Assn within which has a lot of selling to one another from farm to farm, many of the farms have their own customers they sell to and most also sell to the big ones. Its very much a situation of everyone in the business knowing everyone else. There are a number of operations that raise half a dozen or dozen species, livebearers, tetras etc, in ponds and covered concrete tanks etc.
 
Its a situation of businesses being in a limited geographical area and knowing one another on a first name basis. They also have a couple assn. functions a year for business and fun . About the only other similar area in the fish business I  can think of is Singapore.
Jake
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