Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
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yes
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no
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not sure
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Change Page: < 123456 > | Showing page 4 of 6, messages 61 to 80 of 110 - powered by ASPPlayground.NET Forum Trial Version
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Tuesday, January 7, 2014 9:19 AM
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Justin, you and I are on the same page!
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website: http://kathysclowns.com Captive bred clownfish and more (Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Tuesday, January 7, 2014 10:34 AM
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I spoke to the web guy, he needs a list of "needs" and he can quote this. Based on what I told him he is thinking about $1,500 to build. So the initial members, if this moves forward, would divide the cost. Any new member would get charged the cost to have their section built, and a portion of the initial cost. The portion of the initial cost (a direct percentage= total breeders divided by the total cost) is shared by the existing breeders to 'recoup" some of the initial investment. There is an annual web domain registration fee and hosting fees. The web name fee is about $30 a year and the hosting is about $250 a year. So this will need to be factored into the members annual dues, but then again, depending on who buys in, this can be a small fee. If anyone is serious about moving forward with this, let me know. It could be up and running in 30 days or so.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 2:51 AM
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Until you figure out how you can have 10 line items coming from 6 different breeders in 8 different cities and NOT have the shipping for that order winding up in the hundreds of dollars, I just don't see how this works as envisioned. 30% discounts at FedEx don't cut it. Kathy, I think you just need to bite the bullet and set up a captive-bred wholesaler  Buy from breeders are farmer price in quantity, make a solid markup for your time, resources and energy, and sell nationally from one distribution point. Otherwise there's just no conceivable way to be competitive because you have too many separate smaller shipments to compete against the price of one larger one. The other issue - quality control. Who handles complaints? DOAs? Do they go through the co-op? How does the coop fund itself? Does it take a cut of every transaction? If you function as a wholesale aggregator, then there is a quality control checkpoint, and that checkpoint is in MO. If a breeder send you junk, you deal with it with the breeder - your customers never encounter problems. If a breeder can't deliver, then you don't deal with that breeder any longer. If a breeder produces something you don't want to house in house, you can always list it with a price and a "lead time" to availability (basically offer a special order section). I would LOVE to be proven wrong on this one Kathy, but setting up an online marketplace (I think the MBI's was far too complicated...the original MOFIB one actually worked) is far different from that marketplace trying to also be the "unified front" for all the vendors involved. Look at how places like Etsy, Amazon, eBay, Aquabid, handle having "multiple sources"...they stop short of being the "co-op"...each vendor stands on his/her own merits, and the marketplace isn't screwed by any single bad participant in it. But the moment you insert yourself directly in-between the buyer and the seller and present the coop as the actual "seller", things fundamentally change.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:11 AM
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I agree with a lot of what you say above. I think the best way to do this, if it happens is to ensure the buyer knows this is a "flea market" type of place, each seller is independent and if you deal with multiple vendors, you get multiple shipments. You deal with that vendor based on the order number, so the site knows based on logic which vendor to route the claim to. The purpose of the site to to allow people to place the fish in one common location so customers can search in one location for a larger selection. You can also set it up by regions so the buyer knows he is buying closer to him/her. The site would have no direct management or "cut" of any transaction, it has a "fee" that each breeder would pay to join and annual dues, and they are an equal cut of the total annualized expense to run the site (page updates, domain registration, hosting fees). Will it work, who knows unless you try. Technology and B2B web is my business. I've deployed several hundred million dollars worth of it in the past 9 years, and my main focus is health care patient facing technology, and it does not get any more difficult when it comes to trying to convince a 65+ year old patient that they need to utilize the web for health care results, bill pay, scheduling, and referrals, especially in a community where most of the providers are independent. Your mileage may vary.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 9:04 AM
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Matthew, we've talked about this before. If a buyer in Illinois wants fish from breeders also in Illinois or Iowa or Wisconsin, and they all use the Speedy Delivery Company( that you introduced me to), the breeders might be willing to pay the cost of shipping or reduce it to where the buyer gets a good deal and will complete the sale. The difficulties that I have with becoming a wholesaler are many. - First, the fish will have to be shipped twice, once to me, and once to the buyer, which doubles the shipping cost, whatever that is. It also doubles the stress on the fish, increasing the chances that the fish will die before being sold.
- I would have to accept and quarantine fish from other breeders, and I have limited space and inclination to do that. Even though captive bred fishes are generally the most disease free out there, one never knows what wild caught fish a breeder may introduce to his system, and therefore introduce ich and other bad guys to my systems. I have been burned before.
- I would have to accept the risk that the fish I buy from other breeders won't sell. That's a considerable risk for me. I would have purchased fish that I'll have to continue to feed and house, with no return on the investment.
- The breeders would make less money. I am all for encouraging people to breed marine ornamentals. Unfortunately, we don't have a way of increasing prices to the customer, and I'm not sure that's desirable anyway. What happens is, the more times the fish change hands, the more times someone takes their cut of whatever we have to sell, and the money that goes to the breeder gets less and less. The fewer entities that handle the fish, the more money the breeder gets, and in my humble opinion, the breeder does all the magic, and deserves to be paid.
- Actually, the fish itself also does all the magic, and deserves to be healthy and live a long life, and being shipped multiple times risks their lives as well, perhaps unnecessarily, if the web based marketplace can work.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website: http://kathysclowns.com Captive bred clownfish and more (Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 9:16 AM
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+1 kathy, I think you raise multiple valid points!
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 10:20 AM
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Essentially it would be a website that hosts multiple breeders, shows location , and their livestock, I think incorporating the MBI name would be a great idea . Who knows with the amount of traffic it would bring advertising could also cover running costs,and send money back to breeders.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 10:33 AM
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You know, I hadn't considered that. Companies might want to advertise on a website that caters to aquarium stores. Not a bad idea. We could even use the advertising income to discount shipping costs. Hmmm.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website: http://kathysclowns.com Captive bred clownfish and more (Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 2:01 PM
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I don't think the MBI should be involved with that business model. I would think it opens the MBI and MASM to liability and risk. This would be easily clarified by an attorney though. This would be a for profit venture that is actively managed. Much different than the old open forum that was the MBI Marketplace". As for a Co-Op I think you would have to very carefully select/allow members. One bad egg, perhaps one bad transaction, one batch of sick fish could sink it all. A while ago I proposed a "certification" that would provide standards, best practices, and limits/regulations that must be met to obtain / keep certification to help increase likelihood that the product (fish) is of high quality. I think something similar this would need to be followed to protect the members. Basically look at it as every other member is your partner and in some way reflects on every other member.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 7:24 PM
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 Originally Posted by mPedersen
I would LOVE to be proven wrong on this one Kathy, but setting up an online marketplace (I think the MBI's was far too complicated...the original MOFIB one actually worked) is far different from that marketplace trying to also be the "unified front" for all the vendors involved. Look at how places like Etsy, Amazon, eBay, Aquabid, handle having "multiple sources"...they stop short of being the "co-op"...each vendor stands on his/her own merits, and the marketplace isn't screwed by any single bad participant in it. But the moment you insert yourself directly in-between the buyer and the seller and present the coop as the actual "seller", things fundamentally change.
I don't think that the website would differ that much from Etsy, etc, with each vendor standing on its own merit. I think that the bad actors will be quickly found out, and the market will determine if he/she stays or goes. i see no reason to insert directly in-between the buyer and the seller. The "co-op" would just simplify the interaction for the buyer without being liable for the products. Am I mistaken about your point? I feel like I don't understand.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website: http://kathysclowns.com Captive bred clownfish and more (Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 7:51 PM
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I am confused too.  So, what you are describing is a system like what the MBI Marketplace was except with an added benefit of reduced shipping costs and potentially some advertising? You would need to do prepay on shipping I think or else that could be a pretty big hit if someone stiffs you. Also just a concern, will this model work when everyone has the same items? Unfortunately we don't have the greatest diversity of species. Maybe some research of price fixing vs protected pricing would be beneficial. My worry being the co-op would become a big race to the bottom model if you couldn't do something about prices.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:09 PM
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As a member of a co-op you can set prices, however a group of individuals can't because it is price fixing. Shipping would be collected at time of order with the cost of the order. If anyone is stiffed it would be the buyer if a breeder failed to ship. There are a lot of logistics to work out, but a real possibilty. Just need 4-6 breeders willing to try. We waste more money on gizmoes than it would cost to try. If we had 6 people, the initial buy in would be about $200 each.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:27 PM
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To me that sounds different than what Kathy is describing. She is saying that the co-op isn't in the middle. To me if the co-op is going to directly get its shipping then it must handle the complete transaction. And the buyer will not be the one screwed if someone doesn't ship, it would be who the payment went to. PayPal would lock the account immediately. And if I were a buyer and didn't get my product I would file a claim with the credit card company who goes after the vendor, in that case the co-op. The only way to eliminate this would be to make the payment directly to the seller, which opens up my earlier concern. Also, do the shipping companies have any restrictions on doing business that way with them? Seems they really wouldn't be in favor of shipping co-ops. Also, what type of advertising would there be? If it's done by the local member then unless there is a lot of diversity in the offerings each person would just be better to handle their Ocellaris in their local region. If you are going to do enough national marketing to get LFS attention I would think that would be quite costly and at that point you are competing against the big boys. Please don't take my comments as opposition, just trying to help talk it all through.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:33 PM
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Originally Posted by waldend I am confused too. So, what you are describing is a system like what the MBI Marketplace was except with an added benefit of reduced shipping costs and potentially some advertising? You would need to do prepay on shipping I think or else that could be a pretty big hit if someone stiffs you. Also just a concern, will this model work when everyone has the same items? Unfortunately we don't have the greatest diversity of species. Maybe some research of price fixing vs protected pricing would be beneficial. My worry being the co-op would become a big race to the bottom model if you couldn't do something about prices. This is highly illegal. I understand the concern but there isn't really anything that can be done about it. I've consulted our counsel about this in the past.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:42 PM
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The co-op is simply a web page. It is not a person or a company. It is a collective site where breeders buy into it to publish there product. Esty is much the same. When I want a product, I go to the Esty web site, the dealers are independent and Esty provides an interface. The individual breeder would have an individual paypal account, the orders are tied to a product number specific to an individual breeeder. If the breeder failed to ship, and PayPal locked the account, it is the specific breeders account that is locked and not the others. Co-Op is just a function of the site, but there is no middle man/woman. It is simply an interface that allows many breeders to come together to advertise in one location, and to expand to a larger audience of buyers. The breeders pay a fee to the web site. This fee is for annual hosting and domain registration. An initial fee for creation of the site. It is owned by all of the breeders equally. As for advertising the site, it is the individual responsibility of each person on the site, if at a convention, put out flyers, etc. Just my thoughts As for Price Fixing, we can use Resale Price Maintenance http://en.wikipedia.org/w...sale_price_maintenance
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Wednesday, January 8, 2014 8:54 PM
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My interpretation of what you are describing is what was here on the MBI and was called the Marketplace. If the advertising follows that method it doesn't really provide anything beyond local unless I have something that others do not in the other represented regions. The only exception might be like MACNA but that would cost to even put fliers at.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Thursday, January 9, 2014 3:56 AM
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On the overriding "how does this differ from the MBI Marketplace"...well...if the coop has no intermediary involvement between buyer and/or seller, then it's no different than what was already tried and failed. What I saw in the coop concept is things like being able to get discounts on shipping, maybe do what Florida Fish Farmer's association does (which is provide better access to things like shipping supplies and medications), and providing a more seemless interface for buyers. Unless I'm mistaken, the concept was that all sellers items appear together being purchased from the coop, with breeders basically then fulfilling orders by drop ship. Amazon's independent sellers kinda come to mind as a variation on this theme, or maybe the most real-world example of it. I wonder if they maybe even have a shop setup that allows you to establish a branded online marketplace doing exactly this.? The issues that are coming up are readily apparent when you see things like "using the coop's shipping account to get better fedex rates"...Coop has to handle money, pay bills, cover costs. The more "seemlessly" breeders are presented as being part of the "Coop" vs. "independent sellers", the more liability and reptuation risk falls onto the coop...the "one bad seed ruins it" concept. Kathy, to your earlier points: 1. The shipping of the fish twice is what it is. What it isn't is a problem. 2. The costs of shipping the fish twice are not doubled, because the volume of fish shipped in any one shipment more than offsets the "second shipping" cost. Example: Scenario A: 5 Breeders have 50 fish each to sell, and for ease of math it costs $100 to ship from each breeder. 5 fish, 5 species, 5 shipments, $500. $2 per fish to get to the wholesaler. Each breeder makes one shipment. Now, 10 buyers want to buy 5 of each species and want them shipped to them. That's 25 fish per buyer, going from one central gathering point to the end buyer. Assuming shipping weight and packing densities are the same and the rate doesn't vary, each shipment costs $50. That's 250 fish, 10 shipments, $500 in total shipping costs. Middleman makes 10 shipments. Scenario B 10 Buyers want to buy 5 specimens of each species from 5 different breeders through a virtual coop online. Let's ignore reality here and just assume that in theory, you could ship 5 fish from point a to point b at a proportional price, which we've kinda pegged at $2 per fish. Each box of 5 fish costs $10 to ship. Each Buyer is now set to receive 5 shipments a piece. Each breeder will make 10 shipments each. This is 50 shipments in scenario B, vs. 15 shipments in scenario A. There are 35 more chances for things to go wrong, never-mind the reality that a smaller box of fish is more at risk to exposure than a larger box with water, and thus temperature buffer capacity. Now, in the hypothetical scenario, I said sure, $10 per shipment, 50 shipments = $500. But that's a fantasy that everyone one of us can recognize and realize isn't true. The cheapest you can overnight anything anywhere with national carriers is basically $40, regardless of order size. So even if I was to "halve" reality and say that a box of 5 (or 10) fish costs $20 to ship, monetarily we are right back at $1000 in shipping expense incurred, but with a hell of a lot more shipments going back and forth. In reality, if we acknowledge that there is a FLOOR, a minimum price on overnight shipping, and put that at $40? $2000 in shipping fees...in essence DOUBLING the actual "on the ground" expense of shipping because you avoided a centralized distribution point. Reality - I think best case scenario the cost of shipping is indifferent whether you run this through a wholesaler or do nothing but direct drop shipments. But more likely, it's actually far less by moving larger quantities of fish from point and to point b to point c, vs. having many more shipments going directly from A to C. Nevermind that you actually have more physical boxes shuffling around, and those cost money too. You also dramatically increase the success of fish going from point B to point C because it's a quality control checkpoint...we presume that the wholesaler will do a better job of shipping over the long term due to experience...and not just the experience of shipping and customer feedback, but also from observing the shipments sent to the wholesaler from the breeder. To the regional issue - Yes, this might work regionally with the carrier we've discussed, but in the grand scheme of things it's a rather small market, and the "solution" of the co-op only works within this limited area. Small size of audience might hinder other aspects of such a project...there is a need for critical mass to get attention, particularly from buyers. Functioning as a wholesaler Well Kathy, look at what the breeder trades off in all of this. Instead of making 10 shipments, they make ONE. Instead of chasing down payment from 10 sources, they have one trusted client. Of course there are RISKS, but that's WHY you get to take your cut; when I resell fish from other breeders I insist that I be able to double my money...otherwise a deal doesn't happen. You also remove some of the elements of "competition" among breeders..that is to say you have the option of setting your selling price for ocellaris, regardless of which breeder they come from. OR you grade them and you work with your breeders appropriately (which is what I do with Angels...different pairs produce very different offspring).
Originally Posted by KathyL
You know, I hadn't considered that. Companies might want to advertise on a website that caters to aquarium stores. Not a bad idea.
We could even use the advertising income to discount shipping costs. Hmmm.
Now THERE is a freakin' brilliant idea Kathy! Use that income to offset the higher incurred shipping costs. I like the thinking. The problem is that you really want to offset that cost to the buyer, not the seller. But there's no easy way to monthly, or yearly, pay out a rebate to every single buyer based on add revenues for the month...not saying it cannot be done, but unless all the payments come through the website and are handled by the coop, you wont' have the data / access you need. And more likely, the reality is that the revenues you might get from advertising will have to go directly towards coop set up and operating expenses. If you COULD generate enough revenue to offset shipping costs and you wanted to rebate back to the seller (which is probably easier to manage), you'd have to have something like the seller eating half the shipping cost up front to keep the expense to buyers more reasonable, on the hope that it's a good advertising month and they're going to see a kickback to offset that expense incurred earlier. But then I go right back to farm price to a wholesaler, vs. using the coop to sell wholesale direct to retailers. Is the coop going to charge vendors fees for the service? Will the vendor have to subsidize shipping costs? Unless this is free, and unless they get the full actual shipping costs paid for, the seller will be taking a hit on their price anyway. Will that amount to the same hit they take by selling at farm price to a wholesaler? Hard to say, but it certainly COULD. Kathy, I'm not sure I already said it, but being regional, I'm certainly willing to join in the "test market" of this concept if it rolls, regardless of all my constructive criticism / thinking posted above. I have nothing to lose (unless I have to front some money to participate / fund it?) by trying out whatever you ultimately decide to do...if I don't like it, or it doesn't work for me, I simply don't have to participate.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Friday, January 31, 2014 12:57 AM
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I just found this intriguing thread. I don't know fish marketing like many of you, but it seems to me that we're less the "MBI" site and more the "clownfish" site. I don't mean to offend anyone. But a co-op would make it feasible for members to raise special fish that would otherwise overwhelm their local market. Maroon clowns for example. If you raised a batch of 200 babies you'd have to warehouse them for years before your local market could absorb so many. If done right, a co-op could kill two birds with one stone. It could use MBI people to raise special fish which can only be absorbed by a national market, and the larger variety would create a complete product line that retail stores want. No retailer wants to deal with ten different fish sellers, that's why only two national producers offer a full line and dominate the national market. But if a co-op of specialized breeders offered 15 or 20 popular fish and a number of popular inverts, retailers would come through with orders. Especially if one of the two big boys knocked the other out of business at some point and prices increased. Not to be a wet blanket, but I just don't see how a co-op can be successful without a full product line and a national market. Why not team up with a national dry goods wholesaler so they can offer a complete line of dry and wet goods? I'd venture to guess that if MBI could offer a number of species, the dry goods wholesalers would only be too happy to have holding facilities and everything else. Then next year the dry goods wholesaler will tell us that his cousin will provide the ocellaris and MBI can do the other fish. Then it's time for a new partner! I once read a story about a G.I. that stayed on in Italy after WWII and became the distribution agent for Campbell's soup and a bunch of smaller products. After a few years the soup grew into a very large profit. One day the Board of Directors called him in to say that they'd decided to bring the Campbell's line in-house. The guy's life flashed before his eyes. He said "then you'll take all the difficult accounts in-house too because I'm not going to maintain all the specialized product lines after I've given away the most profitable part of the business". Campbell's gulped, thought about it, and decided not to take the soup account away from the guy. Not exactly on topic, but just a story I read that I've never forgotten.
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Saturday, February 1, 2014 1:24 AM
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Matt P said: Scenario A: 5 Breeders have 50 fish each to sell, and for ease of math it costs $100 to ship from each breeder. 5 fish, 5 species, 5 shipments, $500. $2 per fish to get to the wholesaler. Each breeder makes one shipment. Now, 10 buyers want to buy 5 of each species and want them shipped to them. That's 25 fish per buyer, going from one central gathering point to the end buyer. Assuming shipping weight and packing densities are the same and the rate doesn't vary, each shipment costs $50. That's 250 fish, 10 shipments, $500 in total shipping costs. Middleman makes 10 shipments. KL: 5 breeders have 50 fish each to sell and the real cost to ship to the wholesaler is $130 -150, depending on the size of the box. Times 5 is $650-$750, so closer to $3 per fish. More if any die in transit. Then 10 stores want 25 fish each, and each store will pay between $15, if its in the correct Speedy zone, and $130-150 if FEDEX standard overnight, so that's $650-$750 plus either $150 or $1500 for shipping the fish to final destination. Shipping alone may cost up to $9 per fish. Fish must survive two shipments. AND the wholesaler must take his or her cut. We certainly could not sell clownfish at those prices. Scenario B 10 Buyers want to buy 5 specimens of each species from 5 different breeders through a virtual coop online. Let's ignore reality here and just assume that in theory, you could ship 5 fish from point a to point b at a proportional price, which we've kinda pegged at $2 per fish. Each box of 5 fish costs $10 to ship. KL: Each box of 5 fish costs $15 or less, if Speedy, $20 (small box) if negotiated FEDEX, $50 un-negotiated fEDEx. Each store pays $65, $100, or $250. If the coop can get a good shipping rate, the cost for shipping each fish FEDEX is $4 or less. Fish are shipped only once, so the survival rate is higher. There is no wholesaler to take a portion of the profit, which will help to keep prices competitive. The website will need some financial support, but the costs of marketing fish, and maintaining the website will be shared by all participants. Advertising may defray some or all costs, and may help with the shipping costs. Each Buyer is now set to receive 5 shipments a piece. Each breeder will make 10 shipments each. This is 50 shipments in scenario B, vs. 15 shipments in scenario A. There are 35 more chances for things to go wrong, never-mind the reality that a smaller box of fish is more at risk to exposure than a larger box with water, and thus temperature buffer capacity. Now, in the hypothetical scenario, I said sure, $10 per shipment, 50 shipments = $500. But that's a fantasy that everyone one of us can recognize and realize isn't true. The cheapest you can overnight anything anywhere with national carriers is basically $40, regardless of order size. So even if I was to "halve" reality and say that a box of 5 (or 10) fish costs $20 to ship, monetarily we are right back at $1000 in shipping expense incurred, but with a hell of a lot more shipments going back and forth. In reality, if we acknowledge that there is a FLOOR, a minimum price on overnight shipping, and put that at $40? $2000 in shipping fees...in essence DOUBLING the actual "on the ground" expense of shipping because you avoided a centralized distribution point. I've never been able to put a fish on an airplane for under $50 unless it was in carry-on luggage. But without negotiation, FEDEX is the most expensive way to ship. One advantage we would have, is a volume of shipment that would make it worth it to FEDEX to negotiate with us for a decent shipping price. I've been offered better rates before, but it depended on a volume of shipping that I could never make happen. If we all worked together, we could make it happen. Matt, you are in a unique situation in that there are local people willing to sell you items that are in demand, that you can just sell again with very little in the way of shipping costs since you are in prime Speedy territory. Unfortunately, most of the marine fish breeding world don't live near each other. I know your model works for you, and I am happy for it, but I don't want to take on the risks that you have with fish coming in from elsewhere, and risks that the fish won't sell once you buy them. I think we are all better off working together but keeping our fishes separated.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website: http://kathysclowns.com Captive bred clownfish and more (Wholesale to the trade.)
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Re:Interested in joining a marine ornamental co-op? Designed to market your fish, you must be able to ship.
Saturday, February 1, 2014 1:42 AM
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Originally Posted by dave w
I just found this intriguing thread. I don't know fish marketing like many of you, but it seems to me that we're less the "MBI" site and more the "clownfish" site. I don't mean to offend anyone.
If we are only a clownfish site perhaps it is because the success of humans to captively breed and rear marine ornamentals lies mainly in the clownfish world. How else should we be? We are only doing what we can do, while always striving to do better. No offense taken.
Originally Posted by dave w But a co-op would make it feasible for members to raise special fish that would otherwise overwhelm their local market. Maroon clowns for example. If you raised a batch of 200 babies you'd have to warehouse them for years before your local market could absorb so many. If done right, a co-op could kill two birds with one stone. It could use MBI people to raise special fish which can only be absorbed by a national market, and the larger variety would create a complete product line that retail stores want. No retailer wants to deal with ten different fish sellers, that's why only two national producers offer a full line and dominate the national market. But if a co-op of specialized breeders offered 15 or 20 popular fish and a number of popular inverts, retailers would come through with orders. Especially if one of the two big boys knocked the other out of business at some point and prices increased. Agreed!
Originally Posted by dave w Not to be a wet blanket, but I just don't see how a co-op can be successful without a full product line and a national market. Why not team up with a national dry goods wholesaler so they can offer a complete line of dry and wet goods? I'd venture to guess that if MBI could offer a number of species, the dry goods wholesalers would only be too happy to have holding facilities and everything else. It's an issue and one I've been contemplating. But back up. I don't think it will be successful without a full line of different species of fish, all captively bred and reared. With only 50% of the people answering this poll saying that they think its a good idea, I am not sure there are enough breeders willing to risk a little money and a lot of faith to see if this thing will work. We need a critical mass to make marketting be effective. If enough people with enough species joined up, we could find out if it would appeal to the stores that buy our goods, and once the ball got rolling it would not only be successful at drawing in new breeders, but drawing in more buyers, and more advertising. What I really hope it will do is encourage more people to try their hand at breeding saltwater fish! If we make it easier to unload the products, it becomes more fun and profitable to create the products.
check out Kathy's Clowns, llc website: http://kathysclowns.com Captive bred clownfish and more (Wholesale to the trade.)
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